Thought I'd break away this topic from others and give it new life in this thread...here is my personal take on the matter... So if you ask me how close is the 12r compared to these new liter bikes? Not quite, but they are close. Most stock 12's are in the 158 - 162hp range stock, and put out significantly more torque than a 1000 (the old no replacement for displacement scenerio). While testing on the same dyno, the strongest 1000's are in the 152 - 153 range. But of course they are 100 pounds lighter, so it becomes a moot point. It would simply be nice to see a revised frame and a good diet given to the 12. Don't change the ergos too much (don't make it into a 10). It's in a different class than the 10. But given a few updates/changes, I'd buy another one. I've riden the 10r, last year's Gixxer, the new R1, and comparing them to my 12... The 12R quite honestly has just some insane brutal acceleration, but it easily forgotten when I remember how hard it is to slow down or turn in with that extra weight. Take a new liter bike and you can easily cruise through the twisties at 15-20mph faster than the 12. The 12 is the ONLY motorcycle that actually feels like it is yanking my arms out of my shoulder sockets when I give it a fistful of fuel. No bike has reproduced that.